tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2916532122185648082.post5584804026575179801..comments2023-03-31T00:42:14.692-07:00Comments on Conversations With Chris Bernard: The Truth of the Matter ISMolly Broganhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/02864214690848523445noreply@blogger.comBlogger99125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2916532122185648082.post-35869712860489510462008-06-07T08:30:00.000-07:002008-06-07T08:30:00.000-07:00One could not be sure even the concept of a triang...One could not be sure even the concept of a triangle would exist if there was no matter - though there may be existance beyond the ski slopes or treacle of the Higgs' Field - we rather neglect Maxwell. Arguments between camps are best left alone simply because they are arguments between camps and as such likely to be fairly hopeless and based on unrecognised similarities or the exploitation of Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2916532122185648082.post-89345769119448981332008-06-07T08:28:00.001-07:002008-06-07T08:28:00.001-07:00For me, what connects the thinker to the thoughts ...For me, what connects the thinker to the thoughts is being. We may have swung this dialogue around to a new question - what is the nature of being?Molly Broganhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02864214690848523445noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2916532122185648082.post-44064020975544777272008-06-07T08:28:00.000-07:002008-06-07T08:28:00.000-07:00I agree with you Keith but it seems Orn is more of...I agree with you Keith but it seems Orn is more of the 'it takes a knower to know these things' camp. This is one of the reasons I believe in an abstract plane/mind of God. These things reside in the<BR/>mind of God as abstracts and we, over time, discover them, rather than we, over time, invent them. While I accept the plausibility that it takes a knower to know these things, I proffer that Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2916532122185648082.post-90951745153858335902008-06-07T08:09:00.000-07:002008-06-07T08:09:00.000-07:00Yes, some people have talked about numerous concep...Yes, some people have talked about numerous concepts. And, without a brain to apprehend said concept...well...you may get what my point was. If not, you might want to look into: Tsong-Kha-Pa's Final Exposition of Wisdom by Jeffrey Hopkins and/or Mountain Doctrine: Tibet's Fundamental Treatise on Other-Emptiness and the Buddha Matrix by Jeffrey HopkinsAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2916532122185648082.post-5002516688763176552008-06-07T08:08:00.000-07:002008-06-07T08:08:00.000-07:00Spinoza or Descartes (or both) talked about the co...Spinoza or Descartes (or both) talked about the concept of a triangle. Even if no matter existed the properties of a triangle would not be affected.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2916532122185648082.post-1242340999482278022008-06-07T08:07:00.000-07:002008-06-07T08:07:00.000-07:00I think what Keith was getting at is, although mat...I think what Keith was getting at is, although mathematics is a human construction, it's based on what we see in nature. Mathematics is our way of understanding some of the subtle interplay in the universe. The same is true of logic. We didn't invent the concepts as much as we discovered them as already present in the world around us.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2916532122185648082.post-77958564216542239372008-06-07T08:06:00.000-07:002008-06-07T08:06:00.000-07:00The universe has laws including mathematical princ...The universe has laws including mathematical principles which exist without human beings to calculate or work equations.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2916532122185648082.post-9429144168547501552008-06-07T08:05:00.001-07:002008-06-07T08:05:00.001-07:00Keith, was this meant to be a refutation of my pos...Keith, was this meant to be a refutation of my post? If so, I don't see how it is. If not, never mind.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2916532122185648082.post-54092739790117612612008-06-07T08:05:00.000-07:002008-06-07T08:05:00.000-07:00But atoms and molecules obey precise mathematical ...But atoms and molecules obey precise mathematical laws, and are consistent. Gravity utilizes precise mathematics which govern its properties. The laws of chemistry adhere to mathematical equations involving quantity, temperature, pressure and so on. The laws of evolution depend on the laws of chance.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2916532122185648082.post-88820533011189642302008-06-07T08:04:00.000-07:002008-06-07T08:04:00.000-07:00For the record, math is but a human construct too....For the record, math is but a human construct too.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2916532122185648082.post-31545451588609569702008-06-07T08:03:00.000-07:002008-06-07T08:03:00.000-07:00We do think, and therefore we are equipped albeit ...We do think, and therefore we are equipped albeit scarcely, with some means to speculate what links a thinker to his or her thoughts.Rene Descartes believed that God was not set on being a deceiver. It may be that illusion does exist, but I think Descartes meant that God does not deceive for the sake of game playing with humans. That is, illusion is not for the sake of a divine cosmic joke on us.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2916532122185648082.post-7022613098608952332008-06-07T08:01:00.001-07:002008-06-07T08:01:00.001-07:00Sure it is, we choose the possibility for our view...Sure it is, we choose the possibility for our viewpoint.Molly Broganhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02864214690848523445noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2916532122185648082.post-40789482093460727582008-06-07T08:01:00.000-07:002008-06-07T08:01:00.000-07:00Pat might not agree with you, Molly ! His premise...Pat might not agree with you, Molly ! His premise is that all of it is already written by God.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2916532122185648082.post-81264994448517079792008-06-07T08:00:00.000-07:002008-06-07T08:00:00.000-07:00LOL!! Story of my life, innit? It was that thoug...LOL!! Story of my life, innit? It was that thought (of what links a thinker to his thoughts) that led me to think about consciousness as a fetching device for information, fetching into a Platonistic Abstract Plane and retrieving them to our brains. It wasn't until people pointed out to me that it was, in fact, Platonistic, that I gained a huge respect for Plato. I figure, the deeper we Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2916532122185648082.post-83013212982200001742008-06-07T07:58:00.000-07:002008-06-07T07:58:00.000-07:00My, my, Pat ! This is absolutely subtle and came ...My, my, Pat ! This is absolutely subtle and came entirely unexpected.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2916532122185648082.post-46765178664436745562008-06-06T06:49:00.000-07:002008-06-06T06:49:00.000-07:00To a degree, yes; but it still leaves unanswered, ...To a degree, yes; but it still leaves unanswered, 'What links a thinker to his thoughts?'.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2916532122185648082.post-71531795931007689172008-06-06T06:48:00.001-07:002008-06-06T06:48:00.001-07:00BTW it seems to me to be self-evident if you say t...BTW it seems to me to be self-evident if you say to yourself, "I think therefore I am."Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2916532122185648082.post-42066478324670247152008-06-06T06:48:00.000-07:002008-06-06T06:48:00.000-07:00Thanks Molly.Thanks Molly.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2916532122185648082.post-34795914958919311592008-06-06T06:47:00.000-07:002008-06-06T06:47:00.000-07:00Obviously, it is an analogy God writing the book o...Obviously, it is an analogy God writing the book of reality. My own concept of the universe is more complex. I think the universe is actually a multiverse, and there are infinite "universes." The local phenomenon commonly referred to as the universe has parallels and opposites, and whatever else may be conceived of by the infinite intellect of God. God lacks nothing and never did lack anything. Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2916532122185648082.post-8916570513872979622008-06-06T06:46:00.000-07:002008-06-06T06:46:00.000-07:00I can feel your place of essential abandonment, Ne...I can feel your place of essential abandonment, Neil. Thank you. It might be the recent exchange with Francis, but I am reminded of Christ on the cross, "Father, why hast thou forsaken me?" This dark night of the soul position allows us to examine our essential selves. Like Christ, who spent his ministry telling people that "I am in the father and the father in me," sometimes translated "I Molly Broganhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02864214690848523445noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2916532122185648082.post-75384746676172088252008-06-06T06:43:00.000-07:002008-06-06T06:43:00.000-07:00I've been taking a little light relief Vam. It's ...I've been taking a little light relief Vam. It's mostly good to know people in this group are about in the world as I explore some darker corners. I take your love very specially and very much for granted as you can with mine - an important matter in troubled times. My writing has been curtailed by having to apply for jobs and work of one kind or another. I've been looking into the work of a Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2916532122185648082.post-6999022088335925822008-06-06T06:37:00.000-07:002008-06-06T06:37:00.000-07:00Hey, Neil, how goes your writing ? Sometimes, whe...Hey, Neil, how goes your writing ? Sometimes, when you've not posted<BR/>for a while, I miss your posts. But, today, you seem to have some time<BR/>on your hand ! Lots of love.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2916532122185648082.post-64809537960145468762008-06-06T06:36:00.001-07:002008-06-06T06:36:00.001-07:00People write books and chisel stone. Zizek wrote ...People write books and chisel stone. Zizek wrote a booh with 'hypostases' in the title - endless waffle. Good point on god Vam.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2916532122185648082.post-74703434298666874222008-06-06T06:36:00.000-07:002008-06-06T06:36:00.000-07:00You are writing this book right now, Vam. We all ...You are writing this book right now, Vam. We all are. <BR/><BR/>I'm going to assume that your remark is a request for a reference,<BR/>Orn. Greg Braden has a wonderful presentation complete with slides<BR/>about his on site research into the texts and conversations with the<BR/>archive keepers. His book "Secrets of the Lost Mode of Prayer" is<BR/>probably the best reference for this material, Molly Broganhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02864214690848523445noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2916532122185648082.post-74665315331849301182008-06-06T06:35:00.000-07:002008-06-06T06:35:00.000-07:00The question, Kevin, is that why would God want to...The question, Kevin, is that why would God want to write the " book ?"<BR/>You want something only when you feel the lack of it. What did God lack ?<BR/><BR/>More closely, why do YOU want God to have been the one who wrote or is writing the " book ?" What are you lacking, so as to want that ?<BR/><BR/>No, if the above questions anger you, do not bother to reply. If they do not, I'd be glad to Anonymousnoreply@blogger.com